Curse

Daesu · Jun 13, 2011, 05:36 PM // 17:36

These quests are beatable but they take an annoyingly long time.

Some advice:

- Bring Verata's gaze (or replace MM with another rit)
- Don't rely on enchantments
- Bring lots of anti-hexes
- Bring lots of anti-enchantments

These are not typical of meta builds. There are lots of anti-physical hexes from the titans.

Vazze · Jun 13, 2011, 05:44 PM // 17:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kunder

Do you honestly not realize how enormously retarded that is? If the developers seriously think that is how the game is meant to be played then I will be at Bellevue Washington next week to go on a shooting spree.

What he said is not retarded, it is just slow. Did you notice that if you pull mobs into a spirit forest your team takes no damage behind the spirits? Now tell me is that retarded too? What about nuking mobs behind a tank?

I don't want to send you to Washington but games usually let you play through content no matter what. Sometimes it is a push of a button (change difficulty from hard to easy) sometimes it is (cheap or not) tactics.

At lvl 42 you must abuse the AI or the OP skills, it is up to you which one you can stomach.

MArcSinus · Jun 13, 2011, 05:50 PM // 17:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kunder

WiK HM is only marginally easier than the Titan Quests unless you run builds that the enemies in TQs are designed to hard counter. Original (pre-nerf) BFLA HM was harder than any TQ and it was harder in a good, non-cheap way.

This is simply not true, WiK is easy compared to the titan mobs, just look at their skills and levels.
Most of WiK was done in 6-man parties anyway, the Titan quests, except the last one can be done in 8 man parties and give you a much harder time, including the 7 hero update!
I remember taking henchman along during WiK lol.
FYI I farmed BFLA multiple times pre nerf with the help of only one extremely handy skill: Panic.

Can you please explain to me how the Titan Quests are supposedly designed for only 2 to 3 classes? Because that's simply not true. How did WiK not screw professions over and the Titan Quests do? People ran Panic, Spirits and Minions in WiK as well. Actually if you look at it that way, WiK screwed other classes more because of the small party sizes.

As Jeydra said, I see no reason why these quests couldn't be completed by a physical orientated party. Mesmers and Rits are the best classes/heroes yes, and they make these quests much more easier, but other classes can do it as well. Admittedly less effective, but that's not the point. Falsely thinking that they can't is a sign of bad GW knowledge. It's kind of funny that you are the ones which are underestimating and excluding/discriminating classes right now and not the developers.

Xiaquin · Jun 13, 2011, 05:51 PM // 17:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plutoman

Ah hah, but then you run into alienating a significant portion of the player base. See, you aren't the only person, and you aren't the only one with opinions. Just look at how many people complain about shadow form being nerfed, or other skills. It happens. Not everyone can be happy, but they are, for all intents and purposes, attempting to cater to the players that prefer easier content, while simultaneously providing harder content for others to play. It's a rather fine balance you don't seem to be aware of. Game balance is delicate, and player's opinions are significant - oftentimes, slight changes can set off reactions unforeseen among a player base.

"Fine balance"? Over the years we've been served one dessert after another. We had to eat what we caught in the old days when just exploring areas was dangerous. Anet giveth and Anet can taketh away.

Codex solution misses the greater point these quests prove about PvE as a whole; I couldn't care less about them specifically.

DokkyDok · Jun 13, 2011, 06:29 PM // 18:29

Drok's and Titan Source were easy enough because I could go at my own pace.
Had some trouble with NK, Denravi, and Last Day, though. Had to tweak my hero builds a bit.

hunter · Jun 13, 2011, 07:29 PM // 19:29

After wiping a couple of times on each one, i managed to get them all on my War. Here is some feedback:

Protect Droknar's:
- The Titans hearts are a pain to deal with when you get 3+. You NEED enchant stripping or you might as well be wasting your time. I had to change my build around adding dissenchantment on my ST rit and 2x shatter enchantment on my mesmers. Also consider bringing mirror of dissenchantment.
- You need good backline for this, especially when 7H, i found i needed my good old ER/prot ST defensive AND my UA monk to deal with some situations.
- Corner pulling flagging can help quickly dispatch mobs...IF DONE RIGHT. A halfass cornerstone will get your tank dead followed by the rest of the group
- The main problems with this particular quest were overaggro issues and aberrant patrol paths for mobs. Sometimes i got agro in the most wierd places.
- Difficulty 8/10

Denravi:

- Easy. Bring lots of prot enchantment. All the titans here either do elemental dmg or physical, but it can be mitigated through armor and none of them have enchant stripping. If you don't have a ER/Prot with ya after failing a few times you are simply bad at the game.
- The shining blade also helps you quite a bit with your killing.
- Save yourselves helps tremendously over here. A smiter monk can capitalize on the condition/hex spam on melee character, BRING ONE!

North Kryta:
- Can be 8 manned if going from temple of the ages, nuff said.
- 3/10 difficulty

Last day dawns:
- Let me say that this quest is retarded from the way its set up, to the allies' AI, to the scripting, and finally to the shit thats thrown at ya.
- Even before you even approach the king he rushes into a char + titan group. This leads to 2-3 NPCs dying as well as a party wipe in 70% of the cases.
- This is also based on luck. 2 flame keepers on initial group the king agroes
- 15/10 difficulty because of the random bullshit elements in there. needs a redisign

Titan source:
- Can be 6 manned. Easy. You take your own time getting there

Daesu · Jun 13, 2011, 10:42 PM // 22:42

I have a strong feeling we are suppose to use cons for these.

But I have never used my cons for so long.

Chthon · Jun 14, 2011, 02:34 AM // 02:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daesu

I have a strong feeling we are suppose to use cons for these.

But I have never used my cons for so long.

I struggled through without, but I would not blame anyone even the slightest bit for pulling out cons on these.

Carboplatin · Jun 14, 2011, 03:41 AM // 03:41

Just tried out DDF with my warrior, the melee hate is very annoying, without a dedicated hex remover, playing a melee is simply out of the question.

Definitely not impossible, just annoying.

EasyC · Jun 14, 2011, 03:55 AM // 03:55

Just did defend droknars forge. Wow what a PITA that was...

Guess I had about 5 party wipes all up, went through a few summoning stones....pretty much it. You just have to be really careful and take down the mesmer and monk titans ASAP.

Daesu · Jun 14, 2011, 05:51 AM // 05:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by hunter

Last day dawns:
- Let me say that this quest is retarded from the way its set up, to the allies' AI, to the scripting, and finally to the shit thats thrown at ya.
- Even before you even approach the king he rushes into a char + titan group. This leads to 2-3 NPCs dying as well as a party wipe in 70% of the cases.
- This is also based on luck. 2 flame keepers on initial group the king agroes
- 15/10 difficulty because of the random bullshit elements in there. needs a redisign

Yeah LDD HM is almost impossible. How does one do it with only 4 in the party?

King Leeroy always die before I get to them.

This quest is certainly boring.

FoxBat · Jun 14, 2011, 06:18 AM // 06:18

Burning a secondary on fall back can save you many reloads vs. bad spawns. Also be sure to pull/kill that charr group after the bend/before waking the king up.

One thing to keep in mind re: people's different experiences, the missions are generally a lot more hellish on frontliners, yes you deal more damage and can explode AoE sometimes, but you can't hide yourself behind a minion/spirit wall and therefore need actual prots/heals. Any lapse of shelter or prot spirit is instant death when near 40 eles are around. Flagging heroes to the back of you is also a more challenging experience when you can hardly see them.

Outerworld · Jun 14, 2011, 09:33 AM // 09:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daesu

Yeah LDD HM is almost impossible. How does one do it with only 4 in the party?

King Leeroy always die before I get to them.

This quest is certainly boring.

Helps to bring a mesmer hero and lock it on to the annoying casters. As for the first charr mob; it's only really strong enough to kill the Kings guards and since they're completely useless it's not that big of a deal if they die.

Killed u man · Jun 14, 2011, 10:21 AM // 10:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Outerworld

Helps to bring a mesmer hero and lock it on to the annoying casters. As for the first charr mob; it's only really strong enough to kill the Kings guards and since they're completely useless it's not that big of a deal if they die.

If the group consists out of 2 rits (Caretakers + ancester's rage) and a fire ele or ranger, it can happen the king dies before you even get to him.

Ancestor's Rage does about 25-30% damage to the guards, and slightly less to the king (10-15% ish). Depending on the charr AI (which also seems to vary from different attempts), they can get up to 2 rounds of A-rage off (So 4 in total) before you can even reach them. (Even with fallback, you arrive 2-3 seconds after the second Arage hits)

If the Charr Ranger or Ele focusses on the king, which doesn't happen most of the time, the king can, in fact, die before you can even reach him. Maybe with Shelter/Union you could keep him alive, but against such a strong charr-setup it's a lost cause anyways. The Priest also doesn't prioritize the King over his guards, and as such will often waste heals/prots on the guards who die anyways, resulting in the King dying aswell.

I had troubles beating TLDD untill I stopped being so stubborn and just modded my bars. With the right build wars (even as a frontline -how I did it), this quest becomes a breeze. You obviously will need a "good" spawn.

So this quest can only be beaten through the "exploit" of being able to rezone a million times untill you get a decent spawn. I don't think anyone has posted a screenshot yet of beating this quest with the absolute worst spawn and worst AI. (Where they nuke the King down in about 8 seconds, the time it takes for the second Arage to hit)

Iuris · Jun 14, 2011, 11:22 AM // 11:22

For The last day dawns: on the wiki of the original quest, in the discussion section, you can see a map with the explanation of how it's possible to kill most of the titan groups without activating the king, allowing you to pre-complete the quest, essentially.

Daesu · Jun 14, 2011, 03:55 PM // 15:55

Yes the AI sucks, I saw the Monk literally standing there wanding the Titan while being beaten to death.

Ajantis · Jun 14, 2011, 05:36 PM // 17:36

You can always start from Yak's... Hell, even ToA if you have a lot of spare time

hunter · Jun 14, 2011, 06:22 PM // 18:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daesu

Yeah LDD HM is almost impossible. How does one do it with only 4 in the party?

King Leeroy always die before I get to them.

This quest is certainly boring.

Here is how i did LDD on my war. Keep in mind strat might change for a non melee but the basics are the same.

Makeup:

ER/Prot ele with SoH and Judges insight.
SoS/resto rit with splinter weapon
UA Monk.

The reason i am going with this much protection is that titan smash removes all prots, so you need the hand UA monk for the powerful group heals and the spike healing. Also the instant rez is nice

SoS/resto does healing and dmg

ER prot is there to prevent 80% of dmg as well as provide SoH and JI which are stripped if you get hit with titan smash. However they do good untill they are removed.

Let me just say that it took me over 8 tries to get this time, mainly due to changing makeup and until i got lucky with the char spawns. The problem is that the king runs off as soon as you get within his radar range and they are RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing faster than you are. So you can't even reach them till you engaged.

2 problems:
- getting 2 flamekeeper chars on the initial group that agroes the king --> death in 4 sec, nothing you can do. If they survive the SF spam, meteor will decimate them.
- Agro from the titan group which is nearby and occurs 4-5 sec after king engages with the initial char group

Solutions:
- Reset until you don't get 2 flamekeepers. Ideally you should have rangers and avengers but 1 flamekeeper is also manageble, just interrupt his meteor shower.
- Let the RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing helper NPCs die. if you bring sufficient healing it doesn't matter if the priest and/or guards die. If you rush in to try to save as many you risk agroing the titan group. So what you do is stand back and pick the char from range. Notice the titan group will agro eventually, but this still buys you a few more valuable seconds to have a better starting position and/or preprot shit
- Use a summoning stone for this part if it helps ya. It most likely will make no difference but based on chaotic nature of this game, it might give you a few sec.
- ALWAYS kill char first. A titan beating on 1 target is manageable because even if he gets to titan smash, a the ER/protter will reprot the moment enchants are down. However the other char deal close to the titans DEEps and need to be taken care of first
- Be sure you have "rebel yell" on and use vanguard skills, they work wonders vs char.

hunter · Jun 14, 2011, 06:25 PM // 18:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ajantis

You can always start from Yak's... Hell, even ToA if you have a lot of spare time

For LDD do not waste your time starting from Yaks or ToA, it takes over 1 hour to go back to frontier gate and it does not guarantee success. If you get 2 flamekeepers in the char group which is about to engage the king the whole group might die in a matter of seconds.

Lots of shit is bound to happen in that area before the king which might delay you.

I guess if you REALLY want to beat the quest start from ToA, it will guarantee success but Yaks is a waste.

Jeydra · Jun 15, 2011, 01:30 AM // 01:30

I have no honest idea how you guys had this much trouble with LDD. It could be that I got a lucky spawn on my first try, but in the worst-case scenario I don't see why I can't just slot in a copy of Fall Back and get to the King even faster (and he was never close to dying in my run). Even worse case scenario I don't see why I can't just slot in a copy of Infuse Health to go along with Fall Back. The King has Defy Pain, he should not die.

The other quests can all be done 4-man or 6-man without pulling off any "start from Yak's" or "start from ToA" shenanigans, too.

Quote:

I don't think anyone has posted a screenshot yet of beating this quest with the absolute worst spawn and worst AI. (Where they nuke the King down in about 8 seconds, the time it takes for the second Arage to hit)

This statement is like saying "I don't think anyone has posted a screenshot of beating the original LDD with pre-buff Life Transfer". The screenshot hasn't been taken because nobody thought it was necessary to take one. If the quest weren't one-time only, I don't see why I wouldn't be able to get such a screenshot.